Disgusted.....

[Denne]

I just called a client regarding picking up his December paperwork for accounting purposes. I was informed that he was now going to be using QuickBooks and that was starting immediately. I have worked doing accounting for this client for 20 years. The subject of QB never came up. He also added that he wanted his November paperwork TODAY. Like I was going to try to hold it from him or something. I had no intendtion of doing that. I am owed for the month of November and did several things beyond the November accounitng in December. He had messed up someting and needed my assistance to straighten it out.

I totally dreak going to his office....in front of the other employees that know me too....and of course they all know I am dismissed. Would you to there or just call him back and tell him to come to my office at my convenience. I tried to set up an appointment with him on Wednesday, but he said it was not convenient....he was too busy.

I guess I am really hurt by this.....need some assistance!

Thanks............

[TAXBILLY]

I know it's probably too late to tell you this now but my procedure has always been to get the monthly fee first before doing the work.

As to your problem I would call and ask when he'll by dropping by your check for the work done in November.

If he says he won't pay you, then cut your losses, return his documents and don't burn any bridges because if he intends to do it himself because he believed the Quickbooks hype he may come crawling back.

As to your feelings being hurt, think of it this way ... he didn't consider it and you are much better off without him.

taxbilly

[mcb39]

Aren't you just as busy as he is, or even busier? Have him come to your office. He is the one who wants the paperwork and he should be paying for it before he picks it up.

I still have ten months of bookkeeping for a client who died in Dec, 2008. His widow has been here a couple of times for consultations, but she has never picked up that bookkeeping or (as far as I know) filed taxes for 2008. If she calls now, she will be asked to pick up what I have and take it elsewhere. Sometimes it is better to lose or fire a client than to try and deal with him.

[PapaJoe]

In these tough economic times many clients may think of switching to QuickBooks as a way of saving money on their monthly accounting fees. The client will still need you to help with filing his taxes. Offer to help set up his QuickBooks so that he gets the information posted to the correct accounts (for a fee, of course). Also remind him that QB is no substitute for years of accounting knowledge and experience. At the least, you can charge him to straighten out his mess at year-end.

[jainen]

>>he should be paying for it before he picks it up.<<

In my opinion, while there is a certain fairness in that position, it violates the ethics code of CPAs in most states. However, in my opinion it would be perfectly appropriate to offer a final consultation to explain any unusual treatment in the books and advise him how to convert it all to Quickbooks. For a fee, of course, and NOT during your busy time. If he declines, then in my opinion you need not return anything except the source documents he originally submitted to you. (Some practitioners would say you should also provide depreciation schedules and other documents you acquired or created that have been paid for.) Keep it friendly and business-like, and don't forget to ask him for referrals--I would guess he waited so long to tell you because he feels embarrassed and guilty.

[jainen]

>>offer a final consultation<<

Let me say further, get used to it. In my opinion, times have changed in those twenty years. Now it IS easy for businesses to do accounting in-house, with powerful computers and software, Internet research and training, and all. At the same time, accounting requirements have grown. Consider how much more is needed for compliance with state labor laws, how efficient the IRS has become, the results of the Enron scandal, the intensely competitive marketing environment, the truly bizarre world of business valuation and financing. I mean, how does he plan to talk a bank into reading his self-prepared Quickbooks ledger?

In my opinion, there is plenty of opportunity for you to build a lot of new business services on your long-term relationship with this client. Why not become a QB Advisor? Or specialize in some of the more interesting issues that clients can't handle. In my opinion, if this guy's been in business twenty years, there must be certain matters that it's just not cost-effective to spend his own limited time on.

[ILLMAS]

I just called a client regarding picking up his December paperwork for accounting purposes. I was informed that he was now going to be using QuickBooks and that was starting immediately. I have worked doing accounting for this client for 20 years. The subject of QB never came up. He also added that he wanted his November paperwork TODAY. Like I was going to try to hold it from him or something. I had no intendtion of doing that. I am owed for the month of November and did several things beyond the November accounitng in December. He had messed up someting and needed my assistance to straighten it out.

I totally dreak going to his office....in front of the other employees that know me too....and of course they all know I am dismissed. Would you to there or just call him back and tell him to come to my office at my convenience. I tried to set up an appointment with him on Wednesday, but he said it was not convenient....he was too busy.

I guess I am really hurt by this.....need some assistance!

Thanks............

Just a question, what do you use (system or manual ledger) to handle their bookkeeping?

[JonesTaxPro]

Jainen:

I would be interested in becoming an QB Advisor. How does one start into doing that?

Thanks

Sara

[Margaret CPA in OH]

http://proadvisor.intuit.com/content/program/index.jsp

The best way to start is to know Quickbooks really well. This isn't cheap but you do get the latest version, there is a lot of support and I have actually gotten a few good clients from the listing.

[JonesTaxPro]

I have been using Quickbooks for a long time now and would like to become "certified". Just trying to advance myself. Thanks for the help:)

[Denne]

Just a question, what do you use (system or manual ledger) to handle their bookkeeping?

I have a great custom Software for doing Accounting. A great and complete program with personal contact from the programmers themselves. Lucked out to have them available.

[Denne]

>>offer a final consultation<<

Let me say further, get used to it. Times have changed in those twenty years. Now it IS easy for businesses to do accounting in-house, with powerful computers and software, Internet research and training, and all. At the same time, accounting requirements have grown. Consider how much more is needed for compliance with state labor laws, how efficient the IRS has become, the results of the Enron scandal, the intensely competitive marketing environment, the truly bizarre world of business valuation and financing. I mean, how does he plan to talk a bank into reading his self-prepared Quickbooks ledger?

There is plenty of opportunity for you to build a lot of new business services on your long-term relationship with this client. Why not become a QB Advisor? Or specialize in some of the more interesting issues that clients can't handle. If this guy's been in business twenty years, there must be certain matters that it's just not cost-effective to spend his own limited time on.

Excellent idea about becoming a QB Advisor. It is inferior software to what I use for Accounting, but may need to be an option anyway. I would also find it very difficult that he will be able to do his own accounting for less thatn $90 a month......his monthly fee. I make up substancial income on the taxes....not sure he will be back for that either. He seemed to think he could import into tax software to do his own taxes with the assistance of his QB Advisor he has already hired.......

[Catherine]

Excellent idea about becoming a QB Advisor. It is inferior software to what I use for Accounting, but may need to be an option anyway. I would also find it very difficult that he will be able to do his own accounting for less thatn $90 a month......his monthly fee. I make up substancial income on the taxes....not sure he will be back for that either. He seemed to think he could import into tax software to do his own taxes with the assistance of his QB Advisor he has already hired.......

Think of how much you'll make in a year or two, when he comes back with his book completely mucked up and a few IRS notices on badly done taxes.....

Even if you show him the door at that point, the satisfaction may be worth it.

Catherine

[Denne]

So what happened and what did I do?

Yesterday, my husband delivered the paperwork back to this client for the month of November along with his depository coupon books and Sales Tax voucher for December. When he got back he said that he did not receive a check for what he dropped off......I sure do wish I was doing like some of you and collecting in advance. Well, I got steamed....not to normal for me really ;~) I decided that since he had used lots of my time in December for figuring the payroll tax deposit, sales taxes, picking up and numerous phone calls that I would also bill him for December.

Today the former client called asking for copies of all payroll taxes for the last year along with some additional copies of various items. Well.....lots of nerve in my book after not paying....like he normally does every month as paperwork is delivered.

I sat down and composed a letter telling him I appreciated working with his company for 20 years and sorry the business relationship ended to abruptly. I also explained why he was also being billed for December and that I would overlook the phone calls, delivery back to him and taking care of a notice he had for received when he made out his check in payment of Sales taxes incorrectly....he called in a panic over the notice that said he owed $2600.....hummmmm who will take care of those notices from now on? I also included in the letter that his fees based on a monthly retainer were now ended and that he would be billed for any future serves at an hourly fee of $45.00 per hour or any portion of an hour.

Now....I am thinking about blocking his telephone number for the next couple of days. After all....he didn't need me, right? As you can tell....this client is Fired!!

AND....all new clients will pay in advance for anything I do and I will work on getting the older clients converted to the same... Thanks for that tip and your other comments that got me fired up.

[samingeorgia]

Forty-Five dollars an hour? Are you kidding? Have you hired a plumber or an electrician lately? Your fees are too low! If you haven't sent the letter yet change that to at least $ 75.00. $ 90.00 would be even better. This clown doesn't treat you like a professional because you don't charge a professional-level fee.

[TAXBILLY]

Forty five dollars wouldn't even cover the PIA portion of this client fee.

taxbilly

[BulldogTom]

I looked up Denne's profile and she is in Michigan. I believe that is still ground zero for the recession. That may be why the fees are so low.

But I was shocked when I saw that number as well. $90 per month to do all the bookkeeping and sales tax AND payroll tax? That is a head scratcher. And then to only charge $45/hr for a PITA client you just fired?

You are way too kind Denne!

Tom

Lodi, CA

[Denne]

I looked up Denne's profile and she is in Michigan. I believe that is still ground zero for the recession. That may be why the fees are so low.

But I was shocked when I saw that number as well. $90 per month to do all the bookkeeping and sales tax AND payroll tax? That is a head scratcher. And then to only charge $45/hr for a PITA client you just fired?

You are way too kind Denne!

Tom

Lodi, CA

I agree with you. It has been some very hard times here in Michigan and like other Accountants in our area we are trying to hold onto what business we do have. When I was ready to raise the fees for this client a year or so ago this guy was going through a separation with is partner. I have a letter ready for an incease ready for him for 2010, but of course not going to happen.

I am very kind to my clientele. Need to be kinder to myself however and raise fees little by little. I do make up at tax time on the low fees and charge extra there. Still need to do better on the monthly fees......

[michaelmars]

my min fee for even the smallest business ie a 3 person pizzaria is $250/m, w/u sales & payroll tax and corp tax. If many notices or other pia stuff i add a year end fee too. I never spend more than 1.5 hours at a client like this and thats mostly bsing with the owner. [NYC rates]

[SunTaxMan]

I agree with PapaJoe - don't burn the bridges.

My additional 2 cents':

Whatever you tell this client, put it in writing.

And "be nice." Just because a client is not courteous with you, is no reason to return the attitude. A "gentle" handling of the client's wrath (whether that wrath is frustration, or whatever) will ease the situation. Your reputation will last beyond this client.

[Denne]

I agree with PapaJoe - don't burn the bridges.

My additional 2 cents':

Whatever you tell this client, put it in writing.

And "be nice." Just because a client is not courteous with you, is no reason to return the attitude. A "gentle" handling of the client's wrath (whether that wrath is frustration, or whatever) will ease the situation. Your reputation will last beyond this client.

I agree. I have been nothing but courteous as well as very professional..... Really don't want his business at this point, but I hold myself above reacting to his horrible behavior over the last four days.