Janitor Bob Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 client is married at end of 2014 (no children), but moved out and lived apart from husband the last 10 months of the year. no official divorce or separation papers filed. I am assuming only filing options are MFJ or MFS? Seems obvious, but client is going to argue and I want to make sure I am not missing something. Is it any different if official separation agreement (but not divorce decree) had been filed with court? Quote
RitaB Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 Yep, MFS or MFJ unless they were legally separated by 12/31/14. I have never seen a legal separation, and think the odds are better that a unicorn comes in for tax prep. 5 Quote
jklcpa Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 I agree with Rita. The only instance when the length of time living apart comes into play is if the person meets the definition of "unmarried" AND wants to file as HOH. 1 Quote
RitaB Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 Here's two articles you might run for them, then slap them. I know I would: http://www.irs.com/articles/determining-your-filing-status http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertwood/2011/01/14/consider-tax-filing-status-carefully/ Quote
Janitor Bob Posted March 5, 2015 Author Report Posted March 5, 2015 Thanks...It seems pretty clear, but just checking...this client is very opinionated and knows just enough about taxes to be a pain in my butt. She already informed me via e-mail that she intends on filing as single since she did not live with that "bastard" since last February. He always files as MFS and itemizes deductions...meaning she has to do the same...only she has no deductions (1099-MISC income) so always owes while he gets big refund. According to her, he then he gives her an "allowance" periodically from that refund when she is compliant. I am glad to see she finally moved out, but I do not look forward to telling her she is screwed until she gets that divorce or "decree of separate maintenance"....whatever the heck that is. 3 Quote
RitaB Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 (edited) I remember her. Yeah, a lot of people know just enough to be a royal PITA. Makes for good questions for tax forums. I don't like clients informing me. She needs to get divorced. MFS is costing her about $900, right? Or less? Put it back in her lap. Edited March 5, 2015 by RitaB 2 Quote
Lion EA Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 Not too many states have any type of official legal separation any more. (CT does not.) If you have a friendly, local lawyer who could cite your state's law, you'll be more confident. And, use Rita's articles. 2 Quote
joanmcq Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 I'm glad to see she left 'the bastard' though. 5 Quote
RitaB Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 I'm glad to see she left 'the bastard' though. It needed to be said. 1 Quote
JohnH Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 I like clients who know more about taxes than I do. It gives me a chance to tell them they're so smart they can file their own - they really don't need me. 3 Quote
RitaB Posted March 5, 2015 Report Posted March 5, 2015 Hey, here's a good one. I think the fine is "only" $100,000, but we don't care: http://www.ehow.com/info_7961824_happens-file-single-married.html 2 Quote
Jack from Ohio Posted March 6, 2015 Report Posted March 6, 2015 For her to file HOH does NOT require "decree of separate maintenance." The regulations only state that they must not live together the last 6 months of the year. File her HOH and if the children are living with her, claim them as dependents as well. BIG misconception. The regs do not require any legal separation document to be eligible for HOH. 1 Quote
Jack from Ohio Posted March 6, 2015 Report Posted March 6, 2015 No kids Then file single. Same reasons. Look up "considered unmarried" in the regs. Quote
jklcpa Posted March 6, 2015 Report Posted March 6, 2015 Thanks...It seems pretty clear, but just checking...this client is very opinionated and knows just enough about taxes to be a pain in my butt. She already informed me via e-mail that she intends on filing as single since she did not live with that "bastard" since last February. He always files as MFS and itemizes deductions...meaning she has to do the same...only she has no deductions (1099-MISC income) so always owes while he gets big refund. According to her, he then he gives her an "allowance" periodically from that refund when she is compliant. I am glad to see she finally moved out, but I do not look forward to telling her she is screwed until she gets that divorce or "decree of separate maintenance"....whatever the heck that is. I remember the story of this client too. The only status she can properly file is MFS and must itemize. At least she is now living apart now. 3 Quote
joanmcq Posted March 6, 2015 Report Posted March 6, 2015 Can't file single, Jack. You look up the regs. Only pertains if there are kids allowing for HOH. 3 Quote
RitaB Posted March 6, 2015 Report Posted March 6, 2015 You look up the regs. It needed to be said. Quote
jklcpa Posted March 6, 2015 Report Posted March 6, 2015 Right, HOH was never an option for this client. There are no children. I brought it up only because JB mentioned the length of separation and wanted to be clear that that was not a consideration in this case. The only consideration is the marital status at 12/31/14, by decree of divorce or separate maintenance. 1 Quote
jshtax Posted March 7, 2015 Report Posted March 7, 2015 Can't file single, Jack. You look up the regs. Only pertains if there are kids allowing for HOH. If separated they can do single. Chances are what is good for the goose is also good for the gander so 2 single people please. Quote
Lion EA Posted March 7, 2015 Report Posted March 7, 2015 Not until they're divorced or separated by state law. Living separately does not make them single. MFJ or MFS. 2 Quote
jshtax Posted March 7, 2015 Report Posted March 7, 2015 and the last time the IRS audited someone on filing status was when? Quote
joanmcq Posted March 7, 2015 Report Posted March 7, 2015 Do you play audit roulette in your practice as when to follow tax law? I don't. 2 Quote
jshtax Posted March 7, 2015 Report Posted March 7, 2015 I have before and actually taken 2 cases to tax court and won both because the law was wrong. There are people that move out from a spouse and never get divorced and live apart for 20 years and the IRS expects those people to file MFJ or MFS. People have been married and divorced through tax returns for years. Quote
jklcpa Posted March 7, 2015 Report Posted March 7, 2015 I have before and actually taken 2 cases to tax court and won both because the law was wrong. There are people that move out from a spouse and never get divorced and live apart for 20 years and the IRS expects those people to file MFJ or MFS. People have been married and divorced through tax returns for years. Perhaps those wins had something to do with GA state law? Does GA have a provision that considers a separated couple to be considered unmarried after some length of time? As an alternative to that, I've had clients of long term separations that both still considered themselves married to each other, got along great as long as they didn't actually physically live in the same house, still called each other as "my husband" or "my wife", there was never a separation or division of assets, and didn't want a divorce. 1 Quote
RitaB Posted March 7, 2015 Report Posted March 7, 2015 There are people that move out from a spouse and never get divorced and live apart for 20 years and the IRS expects those people to file MFJ or MFS. People have been married and divorced through tax returns for years. Well, these people have been separated 10 months, I believe. I bet the biggest issue here is she is not getting EIC. There's a good one to play loose with. No, she wouldn't get caught, but that's not the point. Just like the people who fudge on mileage and don't report cash. Doesn't make it right. I personally get tired of paying my fair share and everybody else's, too. It's enough to help people legally avoid tax. Anything else is above my pay grade. 1 Quote
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