JohnH

It’s very hard for a client to comprehend our explanation when the result of understanding it will mean they have to pay out more money.

Yes, this is the issue with respect to whether to claim the Recovery Rebate Credit or not claim it in ambiguous situations. Will the IRS computers just adjust it, or will the returns just fall into a processing black hole? Whatever happens, any delay will be the preparer's fault in the mind of the client.

So this may mean the Jan 15, 2021 date is irrelevant at this point, I suppose.

Maybe this has been discussed somewhere? I'm trying to figure out what people who have not received their second Economic Impact Payment AND who are not required to file an income tax return are supposed to do in order to claim the $600 per person. Have received a couple of question on it and don't know how to respond. Has anyone seen the answer to this? I'm assuming maybe they file a return anyhow, but haven't seen any guidance on it.

It doesn’t give the amount. But I don’t have access to their account records, so it’s the clients job to look it up. No reason to discuss it any further with me until they’ve done their job.

For anyone who doesn't have the information, I'm going to send them this link and tell them to get back to me after they look it up. https://sa.www4.irs.gov/irfof-wmsp/notice I sent out my letter last week. It had two main points. 1) No in-person meetings; 2) Plan for extensions.

I'm OK with that. They know where I live, so I trust them to send me a new IP PIN in perpetuity if they wish. I doubt I'd ever opt out anyhow even when it becomes available. I always owe, so all I care about is that nobody uses dummy info to claim a refund in my name before I get around to filing. I tried to get one a few years back, using as a reason the loss (or possible theft) of my wife's passport while we were out of the country. But that excuse wouldn't fly. I was relieved to find out it's possible to opt in this year.

I always file extensions and like many of you I was preparing returns back when we had to enter our SocSec number as preparer. So it’s out there everywhere and I’ve always been a little concerned about ID theft and a false return. As soon as they opened up the ability to opt in I got on board. It took about a minute. It’s my understanding the IRS will now automatically send me a new one every year.

For some people, yes. For me, no.

I have one return that was paper filed back in February, yet the taxpayer has never heard a word about their small refund. It was a young person, first-time filer, single, standard deduction, two W-2 forms. They check the"Where's My Refund" tool at IRS.Gov regularly, but nothing has ever shown up there. On the other hand, my return which we paper filed on extension in early October with W2's, K1's, 1099R's, SocSec income, itemized deductions, and a balance due, has been processed. The electronic transcript is already available, including the calculation for a small penalty & interest. (Incidentally, for some reason our return also got flagged for identity verification and I received a Letter 4883C, but that's a separate story.) Both returns were filed at the same service center, (although mailed to different addresses due to refund vs balance due). I'm beginning to wonder if perhaps the better course of action may have been to send the return claiming a refund to the "Balance Due" mailing address.

Maybe you could tell them "I've given you all the information you need. What you do with it is your responsibility." My guess is that they are going to ask you to pay if they get a notice of $25-$50 of interest/penalty (before the eventual adjustment back down to zero). Personally, I might be inclined to pay the $25-$50 anyhow, provided they promise not to initiate any further contact and not bother me any more.

After thinking this over some more, I'm beginning to see the light. Yes, Bulldog Tom is recommending the better position on this.

I haven't tried Webex, but I use Zoom 2-3 times a week for church-related meetings & classes. I'm a big fan of Zoom, especially since they tightened up their security. Once you master the basics, it's amazing what you can do with it. And it isn't very expensive (yet).

What type of "trouble" is the client expecting? $5 per month (or less) of combined interest & penalties on the unpaid balance, which are eventually going to be wiped out? Sometimes the least profitable clients create the biggest headaches, I suppose because they don't have anything important going on and thus have plenty of time to obsess over the insignificant stuff. Personally I wouldn't give them any explanation, nor would I inquire or speculate with them about their motives. I'd just tell them the info they want will not be forthcoming. End of discussion.

Happy Thanksgiving to all my friends on this forum.

I can think of numerous times when I interviewed potential clients, declined to do their work, and the conversation ended with an effort by them to clarify precisely what the problem was. I assumed they were preparing for what to tell (or not tell) the next preparer they approached. On the other hand, it's usually fairly easy to sniff out when someone comes to you with a scripted story because they've been through the routine with the last person who declined to do their work. Maybe that just comes with experience. But my most reliable tactic has always been to suggest to a potential new client that we put the return on extension (even if early in the tax season). This is especially true in unusual or ambiguous situations. The more they get in a hurry, the more I want to slow-walk the process. That usually solves the problem (for me, although maybe not for the next preparer)

Another one of those issues that arose from unclear and confusing info from SBA at the outset, leaving both applicants and (in some cases) lenders in the dark. I've encountered a few others.

So an interesting question arises. Were the tips included in the wages figure used to calculate the original PPP loan request?

I agree with Gail. If the PPP were simply a loan to the employer, there would be no basis for including employee tips. But the overarching purpose of the PPP (combined with the anticipated loan forgiveness), was an attempt to make employees whole without being too financially burdensome on the employer. And of course to keep them off the unemployment rolls, which somewhat reduced the total unemployment numbers and tried to avoid "windfall" claims. Although I'm not sure that last part was achieved.

No, there have been surprisingly few porn sites in the mix, as far as I can tell. Maybe more among the ones in foreign languages, but I wouldn't likely recognize them unless they're in Italian, Spanish, etc. But the mention makes me think of a friend who was presenting a power point to a group of executives a few years back. His email would pop up a message on the screen occasionally, but suddenly there were several Viagra and Cialis ads in a row. After 5 or 6 had popped up, he just turned to the group and said "I wonder how they know?".

I think I may have found the answer to what's going on. If you don't mind clicking on a link, here's the article I just now read: https://www.howtogeek.com/412316/how-email-bombing-uses-spam-to-hide-an-attack/ If you don't want to click on the link, I'll try to summarize what "email bombing" is all about. The attacker has likely gained access to one of my online accounts (especially one with stored payment info), and they want to try and order from that account. They're hoping that if I get a notification about a transaction I'll miss it, or even delete it along with a group of known booming emails, and the transaction will go through. They might make the effort at the outset in hopes that I'm overwhelmed, or they might try it after a little time has passed, in hopes that they will have exhausted me and I've given up. The article also suggests a few ways to mount a defense, but it's clear that this type of attack is difficult to deal with.

Reminds me of what the owner of a company I worked for used to say. "When we're brainstorming a problem this is a democracy. But when it's decision time it's a dictatorship."

I have myself listed as two other people with different email addresses in my contacts list. Those in turn forward to my primary email account. (I've been told that's a good way to get a heads up if someone hacks into your contact list.) Nothing like that has happened and nobody has told me they're getting unusual emails from me. So I don't think anyone has hacked into my account, although I did change my password just as a precaution. Since posting that question this morning I've shunted 30-40 emails from my inbox into Spam, and dumped about 400-500 out of Spam over the course of about 6 hours. The good thing is that the Inbox spam seems to be decreasing. It's just a matter of someone having tons of emails sent to me, but for what purpose? If I knew what they were up to I might figure out another way to thwart them, or at least what to be on guard for.

Thanks for the suggestions. I monitor my credit regularly, but will step up the intensity. I'll start paying attention to IP address on some of them. I've wondered if they are bombarding my inbox in hopes I'll accidentally open an attachment. Not all the emails have attachments but many do. But I never open an attachment unless it's expected.

In follow-up, this morning I deleted 1,400 messages that had accumulated in my Spam Inbox overnight.